[00:00:00] Adam Walker: From Susan G Komen, this is Real Pink, A podcast exploring real stories, struggles, and triumphs related to breast cancer. We’re taking the conversation from the doctor’s office to your living room.
[00:00:17] This is Real Talk, a podcast conversation where we’re digging deep into breast cancer and the realities patients and survivors face every day. We’re talking openly and honestly about just how difficult breast cancer can be from being diagnosed to selecting the right treatment plan, to living day-to-day with metastatic breast cancer
[00:00:35] and life after treatment ends. Treatment is a significant part of overcoming breast cancer, but what about the mental, physical, and emotional challenges this disease presents? Sarah Cipolla and Reverend Dr. Tawana Davis both relied on their faith to get through breast cancer. Through it, all the ups and downs and good times and setbacks, they had hope for better days and trusted in their faith.
[00:01:00] Hope and faith are powerful forces during challenging times. Susan G Komen leads Worship in Pink, a nationwide program that brings breast health education to faith communities through this effort, komen can reach people who don’t participate in breast healthcare and people who rely on their faith to overcome life’s challenges.
[00:01:20] Sarah and Tawana are here today to share more of their stories and their faith with our listeners. So ladies, welcome to the show and Tawana, let me start with you. Just give us an intro, tell us about yourself, and then Sarah, and then I’d love for y’all to just have a conversation about how Faith played a role in your journey.
[00:01:39] Tawana Davis: Sure. Thank you so much Adam, and it’s such a pleasure to be here with you. Sarah. I am Reverend Dr. Tawana Angela Davis. I am a nine year metastatic breast cancer survivor in active treatment. I am currently living in the DMV. The DC, Maryland, Virginia area. I have two beautiful adulting children. One lives in Dubai and one lives here in DC and two beautiful grandchildren.
[00:02:10] And I continue to take all of my lived experiences, whether it’s obtaining a PhD in the midst of treatment, becoming an ordained minister prior to diagnosis, to being an advocate for breast health, breast cancer awareness, domestic violence awareness, you name it. I incorporate all those experiences to share my story and to give others a semblance of hope during these trying times.
[00:02:39] Sarah Cipolla: That’s awesome.
[00:02:41] Tawana Davis: Thanks sarah. What about you?
[00:02:44] Sarah Cipolla: So I am a breast cancer survivor, obviously like you, thank God. And I went through everything in ’22. Ironically during breast cancer awareness month, October, and found it did what I had to do. You know, by the grace of God, like, you know, went through all my treatments, radiation, surgery, you know and a mother of four kids old.
[00:03:23] 20 to eight years old, so, and two identical twin girls in between. So, and then married husband of just past 20 years. So that’s been a big thing and challenge. But business owner, yes business owner and have a lot of family live in South Florida. And you know, just thank God every day that
[00:03:52] you know, we are still here, both of us, and it’s for a reason, obviously. Right. So it’s been good.
[00:04:01] Tawana Davis: Yeah, absolutely. Thank you. Thank you for sharing. And I’m just so grateful for this opportunity for us to share especially this topic for talking about faith and being diagnosed with breast cancer.
[00:04:18] It seems like those two. It’s hard to put them in the same sentence. Right. And as difficult as it is for me, and from what I’m hearing from your introduction faith has played a large part in the reason why we’re both here today to share our story.
[00:04:38] Sarah Cipolla: Yes, ma’am. Yeah. I would say this was definitely a battle that tested, you know
[00:04:47] my faith, my family, and my strength. It’s obviously very important that you know, you hold onto that hope and you keep that keeps you going. You know, like obviously for, I’m sure for you too, but like for me, you know, my kids and, you know, getting that diagnosis. Yeah, sure. It was totally scary and maybe
[00:05:15] lose that faith, people ask maybe for a split second, and then it’s like, I have so much to live for, like, what am I doing? Let’s keep going. Let’s do what we have to do and you know, keep pressing forward. So, I mean, you know, definitely keeping and being around your, definitely, your circle gets smaller, that’s for sure.
[00:05:38] You find out who your real friends are. True friends. And you know, always there. My mom definitely made it a point to, you know, everyone to be there to drive me to my appointments and everything. And, you know, that was like a huge thing. Something I didn’t have to worry about. And. You know, there was this one lady, I was actually thinking about it today, and I’m dealing with 21 days of prayer at church.
[00:06:05] And there was this one lady that would come in and play the guitar and music and anything that you wanted to, you would just play it. And that really helped me, like, you know, hold, keep that faith and just keep pressing on and, you know, moving forward and keeping my eyes on God.
[00:06:29] Tawana Davis: You hit it spot on.
[00:06:31] There are times when, you know, I become weary and frustrated and angry and confused, and wondering why, and then tapping into my faith kept me… With all of those emotions, my faith kept me grounded, even in the middle of the frustration and the anger, right? Like my faith, I always could go back to my faith, even in the unknown.
[00:07:06] Just reminded that, God, you promised to never leave me, nor forsake me. You are a healer. You are a waymaker. We read about your miracle scene and unseen, and why would I be any different when I’m made in your image and like this, right? And at the same time it’s like, really, God, what was for me was out of nowhere.
[00:07:33] Like I don’t have the gene. The breast cancer gene, my, my parents or my grandparents did not have breast cancer. They had other ailments, but not breast cancer. And so it kind of came out of nowhere, if you will, and when I think about faith and it coming out of nowhere, because faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen.
[00:07:58] So even in the unknown, right, that’s when faith is supposed to kind of kick in. And help us to focus on healing, to focus on hope, to focus on living and redefining what healing and living looks like, because in my culture and in my community, they don’t even mention the word cancer. It’s the big C or that disease, right?
[00:08:23] So how I had to learn how to incorporate my faith and naming the thing out loud, so that we are not afraid of it or we don’t shirk away from it, or we share our stories to help one another survive. And that it was all rooted in faith in community and family because faith is not just something that we exude or we do.
[00:08:50] It’s something that we experience and we experience it through our tribe, our family, our children, our parents, or whoever your tribe is. We experience that, lived experience that way. So I’m with you on, you know, focusing on faith amid all of the trying times and experiences that we had to go through.
[00:09:16] Sarah Cipolla: Yeah, no, for sure. I a hundred percent agree. This came out of left fields for me too. I do not have the BRCA gene either, thank God. And it’s just, it was like, wow. Like, like I said, for those few seconds it was like, what do you mean cancer? Like what now? What now? Where do we go? But for me it was just like
[00:09:46] we got one way to go and that’s it. Like, I want to be here for my kids. I want to, I started at a young age, 18, right out of high school, you know, with my husband. And, you know, it’s just like such a amazing thing to, to be a mother and to watch them grow and to being raise them. You know, they say train up a child in the way he should go and when he is old, he won’t depart.
[00:10:13] I was brought up in that in a Christian home and you know, with going to church and youth group all the time, and I love that. Like I have that and you know, having that now for my kids is, you know, great and getting them involved and, you know, serving and like, we’re just getting into all that now and it’s just amazing.
[00:10:34] But to be able to. I always lean back on Philippians 4:13. You know, I could do all things through Christ who strengthens me, and I just keep that in my head and like I said, just keep going. There’s one way to go.
[00:10:55] Tawana Davis: Yeah. Sarah, in your experience, did you find yourself having to redefine or reshape how faith showed up
[00:11:05] during this trying time or did you pretty much follow, if you will, like how what you were taught and it just stayed with you and it was ingrained in you and you know, just kicked into high gear? Or did you have to kind of shift things a bit because what you were taught didn’t necessarily match what was happening to you right now?
[00:11:29] Sarah Cipolla: I would say maybe some of both. Because yes, I had, thank goodness I did have that background, that strong background and you know to be able to just roll with it. And, you know, like I said, yes, that was devastating news, but I have to believe that God was doing your work through me. And that’s, you know, why we’re still here, you know, and even on this
[00:11:58] podcast, you know, we’re here sharing our faith about God and how through cancer, the big C word, how we’re still here and you know, our stories and like this has led us to something amazing and only one person to thank.
[00:12:19] Tawana Davis: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I… so as a preacher, you know I’m preaching the good news and encouraging others, and there were times when I found it hard to do that for myself, which again goes, speaks to
[00:12:41] my community, my family, my the church members who continued to pray for me and support into me and to make me smile or laugh or, you know when I was going in for one of my many surgeries, they had to move me into a bigger like waiting room. Because I had like 30 people with me and you know, they knew I was a reverend and so they were like, everybody could stay.
[00:13:08] Let’s just move you into another prep room. But tho those moments were the moments that helped me to tap into my faith and not to ignore my fear because my faith had to be stronger than my fear. It’s not that I didn’t have fear or I wasn’t scared. I was. I could not let that overcome me. Right. So I had to focus on We’re overcomers.
[00:13:35] We’re overcomers. Absolutely. So another piece that, that I had to learn, and I asked that question because I did have to redefine what faith looked like, what healing looked like. Because I, my mom died when I was 23. She succumbeded to multiple myeloma, which is cancer of the bone marrow. And people would say, thank you.
[00:14:04] I appreciate that. People would say to me, you know you’re, you are going to be fine. God has plans for you. And then it would hit me. I know they had best intentions, but it would hit me a little different because I would automatically think about my mom. I’m like, so you’re saying that God didn’t have plans for my mom?
[00:14:26] So each of us have a journey, right? And healing shows up either on this side or on the other side, right? So I had to redefine like what I was taught and what was ingrained in me on a, like a superficial level, not intentionally ignoring Who I am and how I show up, but it was still very general and very superficial.
[00:14:52] So I, I had to kind of relearn and readjust how faith was, what my faith walk was going to look like amid a diagnosis that says, yeah, if you make it to five years, you are, you’re all right if, because at the time, you know, studies with metastatic breast cancer or even just a diagnosis. It is a big deal, right?
[00:15:19] Sarah Cipolla: Yeah, I know. It’s wild to think of like I, I’m triple negative and I don’t need a lot that are triple negative and they say that’s fast growing and there it’s not hormone driven, so there’s no other medicine after and you just have to keep hope and prayer that it’s not going to come back. Yeah. Do I have “scanxiety” we call it when we go back in for scans every six months?
[00:15:49] Yes. But I just keep holding onto my faith and you know, like you were just saying about your mom, like. She no death goes in vain, right? Like God has a reason for every single person that’s on this planet that he puts here. It’s for a reason, and who she touched in her path and her journey. I mean, look at you.
[00:16:17] She raised you right. And look where you’re at. Look at what you’ve become. So your mom would be very proud of you.
[00:16:28] Tawana Davis: I can’t talk and cry, so I’m sorry my voice starts cracking. It’s okay. I feel the love. I appreciate that. Sarah, and that’s exactly what I had to shift in my mind. Because one. Like you said, scanxiety. I love that I will keep giving you credit for it. When I use it in my speeches and
[00:16:51] when I go talk.
[00:16:51] Sarah Cipolla: Well, it’s my breasties that we meet once a month and it’s a whole bunch of us breast cancer friends and yes, we all say that, so yes.
[00:17:02] Tawana Davis: That is so spot on is I just had scans actually, and it took them longer to send the results. So I was like, what’s taking so long? Is something wrong? What’s happening?
[00:17:13] You know, usually it hits my MyChart before it even gets to my oncologist. Right. So that’s anxiety is real. I had it too right before Christmas on the 23rd. And I like, felt like I was putting it off even too, like, do I want to hear this? Like before Christmas, before New Year’s and New Year? And they still, like, I didn’t even really hear, I had to log in and find it.
[00:17:43] Sarah Cipolla: So, but yes, thank God we’re here, we’re clean and so what else are you going through at this time? I heard that you’re still in active treatment.
[00:17:59] Tawana Davis: Yes. Yeah. So every three weeks I’m still in active treatment. The I’m grateful. I’m on a targeted therapy and not a chemotherapy, so it’s less grueling. Yeah, so the targeted therapy, I can do podcasts and drive and travel and do things, so I’m grateful for that.
[00:18:22] And with that, there came a lot of other issues because chemotherapy is so harsh and as it is killing, if you will, the cancer cells, it’s also damaging good cells. I mean our, you know, our research, which is so important, keep funding these organizations who do research because it’s so important. Because someone with me, with a, her two positive diagnosis that was very aggressive, I probably would not have made it to five years had I been diagnosed several years prior.
[00:18:57] because of all of the advances, right? So with that I had some adverse reactions to some meds. So I have damaged kidneys, I have a damaged liver, I have aortic regurgitation. So it’s all these other things that come into play. So my team of doctors have become like an army. A cardiologist, an oncologist, primary care, a gynecologist, dermatologist.
[00:19:23] You know, the list goes on and on, right?
[00:19:25] Sarah Cipolla: You got an army of angels there.
[00:19:28] Tawana Davis: I have an army of angels and language. Sarah, thank you for inserting that because language is so important when we talk about faith. I had to teach myself to speak life and to, because right. Life and death is in the power of the tongue.
[00:19:46] So I had to speak differently, like, and not speak as if you know this cancer is going to take over.
[00:19:55] Sarah Cipolla: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. We’re, we can’t be fearful. We have to just be so positive. Hold onto that faith. Hold onto that hope one day. I mean, we’re going somewhere, right? So one day on that side of heaven, you know, I can’t wait.
[00:20:15] I mean, but we just got to, while we’re still here, keep planting those seeds and the people that need it. And you never know who you’re going to run into. We were, we were just talking about it, I think today or one of the other days at prayer. And you know, you never know who, if you’re too busy or you’re on your phone or whatever, like who you’re going to miss when you don’t say like yes to God.
[00:20:40] If you don’t, you might just miss out on really something that’s really important. So.
[00:20:45] Tawana Davis: That’s good. That’s good. It’s like a rose that grew from the concrete. You just never know, right?
[00:20:51] Sarah Cipolla: Yes.
[00:20:52] Tawana Davis: You just never know.
[00:20:55] Adam Walker: Well, I just I wanted to jump in and a couple things, you know, I wanted to say thank you for for letting us listen in to your conversation.
[00:21:05] You know, I think it’s a, I think it’s a good and important conversation, and I appreciate y’all, you know, being honest about your struggles. You know our, we’ve got listeners from a lot of diverse backgrounds and diverse beliefs. And so I wonder also what message you would have for them about the power of believing your circumstances could get better.
[00:21:29] And I wonder if maybe each of you could talk about that for a minute.
[00:21:32] Sarah Cipolla: Just never lose, you know, that keep your eye on the prize. Like whether you have a family, you have kids or not. Like you got to keep living and keep it’s doing for you and for, you know, just keep your eyes focused on God, no matter first and foremost.
[00:21:52] And then He will get you through. You’re not alone. You, there’s always someone around like, you could even call me. But yeah, it’s, you just got to just keep going on. That’s all.
[00:22:08] Tawana Davis: That’s good.
[00:22:09] As one who has an opportunity to interact with different people from various backgrounds, various religions and spiritual beliefs. The one, one of the many common denominators is faith and love and hope. And when I am in community because having a community is so important and unfortunately not many people have community.
[00:22:43] Not many people have those that are speaking life. It’s more questioning, why are you taking the chemo? Why are you doing this and you lost weight? And you don’t need negative negativity in your space. So keep positive beloveds in your space and build a community. It can be a community of two, it could be a community of 200.
[00:23:03] Have a community because healing happens in community because we’re connected spiritually. The late Archbishop Desmond Tutu says that we are, our humanity is inextricably bound. So if I’m not, well then Adam, Sarah, you are not well. If you are not well, and if you are not well, I’m, so got to, we got to, we got to do this thing together and feel all the feels and still bring it back to your faith.
[00:23:32] Your spirituality. Finally Reverend Dr. Allen Boesak, who was very instrumental in helping to abolish apartheid in South Africa. He often quotes Saint Augustine, and I love this quote. He says, hope has two beautiful daughters. Anger and courage. Anger at the way things are, and the courage to ensure they don’t remain that way.
[00:23:56] So sometimes when we talk about faith being the substance of things hoped for, it’s being angry about a situation and having the courage to build community, to heal, to focus on God’s word, to focus on the unknown, to be open to healing in a different way, and that’s not so prescribed or so rigid. So I would say hold on and tap into and always return to that faith base like that home base.
[00:24:24] You know, with community, even when you don’t have the words, somebody is praying for you, somebody is pouring into you. So the importance of community hope, faith. Love and focus.
[00:24:39] Adam Walker: Yeah. I love that. I love, I mean and I love that you mentioned, you know, community in particular because I hear over and over as I get the opportunity to talk with people on this show that it’s the people it’s the
[00:24:52] the community around them that really makes a huge impact on their health, on their mental health, on their happiness. So really appreciate you sharing that. So Tawana, Sarah, I appreciate you just sharing your story for being authentic, for being authentically you and for being here today.
[00:25:09] Thank you for joining us on Real Pink.
[00:25:12] Sarah Cipolla: Absolutely.
[00:25:13] Tawana Davis: Thank you. An honor.
[00:25:16] Adam Walker: And thanks to Merck and Novartis for supporting the Worship in Pink program.
[00:25:27] Thanks for listening to Real Pink, a weekly podcast by Susan G Komen. For more
[00:25:31] episodes, visit real pink.Komen.org. And for more on breast cancer, visit Komen.org. Make sure to check out at Susan G Komen on social media. I’m your host, Adam. You can find me on Twitter at AJ Walker or on my blog adam j walker.com.