[00:00:00] Adam Walker: From Susan G Komen, this is Real Pink, A podcast exploring real stories, struggles, and triumphs related to breast cancer. We’re taking the conversation from the doctor’s office to your living room.
[00:00:17] Breast cancer doesn’t just affect the person that’s diagnosed. It touches families and can often inspire a life’s purpose. Today’s guest grew up witnessing breast cancer firsthand supporting her mother through surgeries as a young teenager. This was an experience that would later influence her passion for the work she does today.
[00:00:37] As a Wacoal fit consultant, Pam Gibson provides women more than just measurements. She offers confidence, comfort, and compassion during some of life’s most vulnerable moments, whether you’re recovering from breast surgery, navigating your own health journey or simply want to better understand the physical and emotional importance of a proper profiting.
[00:00:58] This episode is filled with practical advice and reminders that support comes in many forms. Pam, we’re so glad to have you here. Welcome to the show.
[00:01:07] Pam Gibson: Thank you. It’s, I’m glad to be here. Thank you so much for having me.
[00:01:11] Adam Walker: Well I understand you’ve got a family history of breast cancer. So let’s start by walking through that.
[00:01:18] Who in your family has been touched by breast cancer and was it something that you openly talked about?
[00:01:25] Pam Gibson: So, yes. It started with my mother. She had her first radical mastectomy in 1970 when I was only 10 years old. And at that time she was, the surgery was done by her regular physician. You know, her just, you know.
[00:01:45] Just the run of the mill guy that sees you for colds and such. And so as a result of that I really wasn’t aware too much of what was going on. You know, it’s a 10-year-old. And then they had mentioned to her if she lasted for 10 years, if she was a survivor for 10 years, that she probably wouldn’t have it.
[00:02:06] And she did, she ended up having a second surgery in 1980. So at that time she was seeing a specialist and he performed a incredibly great surgery. He was going to do reconstruction and she was under too long, so they did not perform reconstruction. And I just remember at that time how much of an emotional toll it took on my mother.
[00:02:34] In fact, one day I saw her standing in front of the mirror crying. And she just, you know, as women, we always want to look our best. And although no one else was kind of implying that she was anything less, we she felt that about herself. So it kind of spurred my entry into the breast cancer world
[00:02:57] and since then I’ve had a couple first cousins. I’ve also have multiple friends that have had it. And so it just, it’s created this empathy and compassion in me that wants to surround myself with giving education to all those that. Aren’t really practicing good breast health and or are not getting regular checkups.
[00:03:25] Adam Walker: Okay. I appreciate you, you sharing that. So let’s talk about how, like, how has this empowered you to take charge of your own health and then also to counsel your daughter related to her health?
[00:03:38] Pam Gibson: So as, when it comes to my daughter’s health, my daughter’s 28 and I’m very worried about her.
[00:03:45] Because I also learned recently that through ancestry.com, my great grandmother died from breast cancer, and so I don’t want this family history to continue. So I’ve also been, you know, talking to her about getting regular checkups and just making an effort. And then for myself, I went and did the BRCA test and was able to find out that I was negative.
[00:04:15] But I know that each year they create more markers, and so I’m sure that we’ll be able to even fine tune that more in the years to come. And I just want to keep on top of it.
[00:04:27] Adam Walker: Yeah. Yeah. As you should. As you should. Right. So, all right. So let’s rewind back, you know, to the past.
[00:04:35] You’re very young. Your mom had, you know, surgery, two surgeries, right? Correct. You’re, I think you’re a young teenager for the second one, Uhhuh. How did that help develop the passion that you have for helping women today?
[00:04:50] Pam Gibson: So I was the one taking my mom to her fittings for not only a prosthesis, but also for her bras.
[00:05:00] And just became aware of how important it was for her to not only look, feel pretty in addition to just the whole emotional side about it I don’t think it, it wasn’t talked about, you know, in fact, the only reason I learned about my great grandmother is because I did this research, but I think her generation just didn’t talk about those things a lot.
[00:05:27] So that’s why I want to get the word out, you know, make sure that people are openly talking about it and not thinking that they’re the only ones going through this process.
[00:05:38] Adam Walker: I love that. I love that’s so important. That’s so important. So tell me about your role as a Wacoal fit consultant. I have to imagine that the support you give women is tangible and emotional.
[00:05:49] So just kind of walk us through that.
[00:05:51] Pam Gibson: Yeah. So it had, I known that that early response would’ve led me to this point. I didn’t think about that at all. That was not something I had on my radar. And I was actually invited to interview for a position with the department store as a fit trainer. And so I was a consulting and I was helping train all the consultants on that department stores
[00:06:16] selling floor. And then I eventually w well, I had developed a relationship with Wacoal 15 years ago when I was doing that for the department store. But most recently, within the last five years, I’ve been working for the company and really have found my purpose, I feel like because when you’re in the fitting room with a with a gal.
[00:06:38] It’s really not a one size fits all approach, and I’m not even just talking about the sizes. There’s multiple sizes in the bra market, but in addition to that, it’s the shape of her body. And even though her and I could be the same size, we might not find the same bra. We really are a great resource for those individuals to get fit into a bra that fits their body type, and that could be because they’ve had a lumpectomy, they could have had a mastectomy, they could have had radiation.
[00:07:11] There’s all these factors that create differences in our body along with the normal things that happen to every person, which would be weight gain, weight loss, you know, pregnancy hormones, all those kind of things. So really, we have to be in the room with them in a very intimate setting talking about how we can best serve their needs and listening to what they’re actually looking for.
[00:07:37] Adam Walker: Okay, so so let’s talk about bra fittings for a minute. I do know that it’s pretty common for women to have ones that don’t fit correctly. Right. And so, so talk a little bit about why it’s so important to get correctly fitted.
[00:07:54] Pam Gibson: Okay, so most women would rather go to the dentist than to come see us.
[00:08:00] It, it could be a very lengthy, you know, tedious process. However, if they use our council, if they use any one of the, you know, fit experts out there in the stores we can generally get them very quickly. Put into a bra that fits them, that’s not only comfortable, but supportive and those are the two main things that people are looking for.
[00:08:23] Yeah. But in addition to that why there’s a sea of bras out there and why would you have to muddle through all of them when we can direct you to, the perfect shape for you, the perfect size, the perfect fit. And we also have a lot of technologies out there now that make bras very supportive for the non wire category.
[00:08:50] And a lot of women are asking for that for comfort. And a lot of times a surgeon will refer them to a non wire option, especially post-surgery. And so when that happens, we like to, be able to just able beline them right to the ones that are going to work correctly for them and give them the best benefit.
[00:09:14] Adam Walker: Yeah, that’s great. That’s great. And I assume the end result, again, this is a bold assumption on my part. I recognize that, but I assume the end result is a better fit, a better feel, better support, better. I mean, just better, more comfortable all around. Is that right?
[00:09:30] Pam Gibson: Absolutely. And so a lot of women that though they’re looking for breasts for different
[00:09:37] pieces of their life. So we call that ing. And so maybe she’s going to a wedding, maybe she’s going on a 15 hour plane, flight somewhere. You know we have the tools in our toolbox to help them fit right into those categories.
[00:09:52] Adam Walker: Got it. So, all right, so you mentioned women would rather go to the dentist than go to a bra fitting.
[00:09:58] So do you have any tips for women about what to do if they’re nervous about a fitting? Because it’s obviously pretty intimate and pretty vulnerable. Yeah.
[00:10:08] Pam Gibson: Yes. Well, again relying on your FIT consultant is the best way to go. However, I will tell you that if they, for some reason say where they live makes it so they can’t get to a store that has a FIT consultant or they, they’re home bound because they, they’re in a wheelchair or something there, there’s some reason why they can’t get to a store. On our website, Wacoal- america.com, they can actually go in and do our fit calculator. There’s we, they can talk to a FIT consultant on the phone. It shows you how to measure yourself.
[00:10:45] There’s all those things, but I really.. If you have the option of going to a store, it’s just that whole connection. I can really listen to me what she’s saying. I don’t like the way this feels on this side. You know it’s tied across my back. You know I don’t like the shape of how this looks under my clothing, et cetera.
[00:11:07] So we can really zone in very quickly into what they need because we know exactly how each and every one fits.
[00:11:16] Adam Walker: I love that. Okay. And for listeners that are preparing for surgery or maybe just had surgery, do you have any recommendations or tips on like, best types of brass to get, or like one particular thing they should be focusing on?
[00:11:31] Pam Gibson: So, I always tell women I’m not a doctor, I’m not a surgeon, so I can’t specifically tell you what your surgeon’s looking for, but when they, again, give me those key points of what they’re. After. And in most cases, post-surgery, it’s wire free. Mm-hmm. And so we have what we call a mastectomy bra that has a front closure and it has no wire and it has compression.
[00:11:58] And a lot of surgeons ask for that. Just kind of the general guidelines they’ll ask for, and then we can fine tune them into the bra that fits that exact, you know, persona.
[00:12:11] Adam Walker: Right, right. Okay. That sounds great. So, all right, so where can listeners connect with a Wacoal fit consultant? Is that, like are you everywhere?
[00:12:25] Where are you at?
[00:12:26] Pam Gibson: All major department stores across the country.
[00:12:29] Adam Walker: Really? Okay.
[00:12:30] Pam Gibson: Yeah. So you know, you’ve got your Dillards and your belts and your Nordstroms. I don’t know, bullocks and Macy’s, all the different department stores. I’m sure there’s ones I didn’t name that we’re in. But in addition to that, like I said, if they want to go directly to the website, they can get a lot of tools.
[00:12:48] If they want to do that individually and on their own we’re there to service them and most markets. I think we have, I think my marketing department was telling me we have about 80 consultants across the country right now. Mm-hmm. And so like I serve, you know, one market, like I serve the state of Colorado, but then there might be another consultant that serves, you know, Atlanta area.
[00:13:14] But then they also, maybe there’s some on the outskirts of the city that they service as well. So, you know, all over the United States and, we’re there we’re waiting for you.
[00:13:27] Adam Walker: So, yeah. So, I mean, so Well but you’re not there in person. So do you have, do they have to go in and like, make an appointment?
[00:13:33] Is that how it works? Like they go and ask for you? No, they can. Okay.
[00:13:35] Pam Gibson: They can do that. Right. I’ve oftentimes made appointments with individuals, say they didn’t have time that day and we connected in the store, and then they’ve come back again.
[00:13:45] Adam Walker: Okay.
[00:13:45] Pam Gibson: We’re not there every day, but we are there regularly, you know?
[00:13:49] Adam Walker: I see. So you, they could go in and ask. And then if you’re there, see you and if not, make an appointment and come back at that time.
[00:13:55] Pam Gibson: And then they might see the individuals that work in the store that are all, typically if they have because sales associates working in the lingerie area, they’re FIT certified as well, and they have..
[00:14:07] Adam Walker: Oh, okay.
[00:14:07] Pam Gibson: A lengthy process to get to that point, but obviously if they want to work with us directly, we can always make appointments for that.
[00:14:14] Adam Walker: Okay. Okay. So, so, all right. So I’m just trying to make sure I’m clear for our listeners benefit. So, so there are likely retail people there right now that are FIT certified.
[00:14:25] Mm-hmm. But if they want. You, the FIT consultant, they can also ask for you and schedule an appointment as well, either one.
[00:14:32] Pam Gibson: Exactly. Yep.
[00:14:33] Adam Walker: Okay. Thank you that helped a lot. I appreciate it. Okay. Yes. And last question then. What parting advice do you have for our listeners? What do you want women to know?
[00:14:45] Pam Gibson: So what I would like to say is you brought up earlier that most women aren’t wearing the right size bra. I want them to take care of their breast health. I really would like them to be open to the education that we provide. Like I always want to work with young people. I and I oftentimes ask their mother, you know, do you mind if I just throw in a few tips?
[00:15:08] Because they’re going to go the rest of their lives buying bras, and if I can catch them now, they can obviously have some good, just remedies to go through life, you know and look for, like we use the five points of fit. And if I can even just get those into somebody’s head, you know, women that are my age and even older seem to think they know how to fit themselves and a lot of times they just don’t.
[00:15:34] And they weren’t ever given those, recommendations early in life. And so let us be your, you know, your guide and get you into something and listen to the education because your body’s organic and you’re changing all the time.
[00:15:50] So you can’t just go in and thinking you have a one size fits all approach, you know?
[00:15:54] Yeah. It just doesn’t work that way.
[00:15:56] Adam Walker: Well, Pam the, this has been fascinating. I have to say it’s a conversation I’ve never had before and I really enjoyed it. You made it very approachable and simple. I appreciate that and I think our listeners appreciate that as well. So thank you so much for joining us on the show today.
[00:16:12] Thank you for the work that you’re doing.
[00:16:14] Pam Gibson: Thank you so much. I was, it was a pleasure to be here.
[00:16:20] Adam Walker: To answer the question of what’s next for breast cancer patients, Susan G Komen is proud to present the Breast Cancer Breakthrough Series, a virtual shareable educational series in partnership with industry experts, scientists from academic institutions. And patient advocates who directly speak to recent clinical research findings and new treatments.
[00:16:41] This series focuses on the new science and technologies that are close to becoming available to patients. Thank you to AstraZeneca for their support of the Breast Cancer Breakthrough Series.
[00:16:57] Thanks for listening to Real Pink, a weekly podcast by Susan G Komen. For more episodes, visit real pink.komen.org. And for more on breast cancer, visit komen.org. Make sure to check out at Susan G Komen on social media. I’m your host, Adam. You can find me on Twitter at AJ Walker or on my blog adam j walker.com.